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Who wants to be dictated to by the State on how you support your children what, how and when?
Whilst many views float around arguing for and against child support, most decent fathers and parents would argue the issue is not whether or not they wish to support their children, but rather the often unfair conditions imposed upon them.
Simply, it's an attack on the nature of a father's freedom and how he best wishes to raise and support his children in the many different ways a responsible father can, which are often more effective and benefical to a child than any 'slap-bang' instrument of government and statism can ever be.
For a father going through separation/divorce, experiencing the loss of family and children, horrendous false allegations, litigation, uncertainty of where your children are and how they are doing, often causes ill health, work and life instability in so many ways. Also, the effects from not having a fully functioning and emotionally present Dad in a child's life can be equally, if not more devestating as their development can be hindered considerably.
Then if that isn't bad enough, along comes an assessment from the Child Support Agency (CSA) for an outlandish sum of money based on your capacity to work at the highest rate when you were fit and able and on fire, which is possibly a stark contrast to where your financial position is today, or will be in the future if you are unable to recover from the upheaval of a traumatic separation that's often compared to a fate worse than death.
From 2006 CSA powers in Australia have increased to not only garnish your wages, but directly withdraw from bank accounts any amount they deem appropriate, siezing assets of any sort to pay the often highly questionable and unjust debts. As Fathers are assaulted with such draconian measures, one can only feel a sense of dictatorship giving rise to a totalitarian society not a free Australia causing fathers to unite and fight for their rights and freedom.
As there are many issues surrounding child support and the effects upon fathers, children and families,
Need some advice if you can respond it would be great
I religiously have paid child support for my 14 & 16 year old until I was made redundant in late May 2017. Since then I haven't seen my kids as apparently they refuse to come now ( coincides with me not paying maintenance ) as this has happened before 2 years ago when the same thing happened
My question is two fold?
1. Do I still have to pay full child support ( based on zero care ) even if I have family court orders stating I'm supposed to get 35% care or 128 nights per annum? If so, This would mean on earning $160K (she earns $80K ) according to CSA Calculator I would have to pay her $2900 per month? Is that right? Since when do kids cost this per month?
2. What can I do to reduce this as going through family court resulted in me being told to go to family councilling! This woman has totally damaged my relationship with my kids for years - any advice great fully received
I went through all the avenues to fight same scenario. Reason 8, no good, CS help australia, cost me 1k for them to make a phone call and write a letter, no good. Administrative Tribunal with overwhelming evidence and the csa law on my side....still lost. I now just cop the fact the ex left a well paid job to start own business and claims under thresh hold every year, 26k and doubled my payments. She apparently can afford to renovate a house and adding 2 extra rooms and private schooling on this income. The AAT female judge èven tried to coax her to claim more school fees from me during initial 3 way phone interview. It was then I knew I was up against it even before the hearing date. My wife and I after trying every avenue for a fair and equitable outcome, have now resigned to live with it and be happy rather than stress. The system enables vindictive and greedy mothers to use the system. Unfortunately, all the great things like camp trips and holidays I used to do with my sons have now ceased due to affordability. Cheers AAT, good luck dads.
Like many on this forum, I have had a terrible experience at the hands of the CSA.
I would like to see the Change of Assessment process changed or abolished, as it currently gives the CSA far to much power to arbitrarily set the paying parents Income, and therefore Child Support Amount.
There is anecdotal evidence that 21 fathers take their own lives each week as a result of these rulings, however nothing seems to change.
It is my belief that if concrete evidence supports these statistics, government would be more inclined to change the process.
To this end I have contacted the data department at the CSA and asked them to provide me with the deceased statistics for the past 3 years, specifically with regard to parents undergoing COA, review or AAT processes.
The CSA is prepared to supply the report, but have quoted me a figure of $7,000 to perform the work. Which I do not have.
Is anybody on this forum aware of any Not for Profit organizations that could asdist with this ?
it's so frustrating and so unfair that once it's on paper their response is - sorry sir you need to pay, we can work out a payment arrangement but that will cost you an additional $40 a month.
Yeap, thanks for that. Try and do the right thing and you get to live on the bones of your ass for the next 12mths until you catch up on your own expenses.
I'd just like to remind people it is not just men that lay child support . Women pay too.
My ex has full care of our 15 year old. Who is mostly alienated from me . I left the man because I was was not happy being the bread winner with him working very little. Now I have my 18 year d who I support and oY full amount for 15 year old . So he wins again. At the end of the day with his low income , my child support and family tax he will have a bigger income than me .
Oh and did I mention he inherited money that doesn't count in the assessment
So I feel your pain boys .
My ex does the same thing. She normaly works for 1.5 to 2 years max at her max " capacity to earn" ,but I'm paying the top amount to her cause its based on her centerlink income, because she does her tax return after she quits/looses her job. I have given csa her employers information etc. And they do nothing with it and don't demand back pay from her cause by the time she does her tax return she is back on centerlink and they wont recover the money from her cause she is on centerlink benefits.
You must remember its a bullshit barbaric system designed to devide and conquer and create hatred amongst people.
The cs formula should be the mothers "capacity to earn" ×2- (self support for mother/father ) ×18% (one child) ÷2= what father should pay.
And it should be for the whole time of the cs payments.
Yeah she may choose to stay on centerlink her whole life but at least you paid exactly half for the support of your child and it will eliminate a lot of the bullshit.
I am the wife of a very good man who regularly and religiously pays his monthly child support, based on assessments for both he and his ex/wife. Recently his ex-wife accepted a well paid full time job (approx $65k per annum) which is great, but she is refusing to declare this to CSA, which according to their guidelines is omitting to declare a change of income, while still receiving the full CS amount based on assessments calculated 4 years ago - surely this is fraud. We have reported this numerous times to CSA but it falls on deaf ears. We are incredibly frustrated!
What are the repercussions if he stops paying CS? Does she need to get a court order to garnish his wage? Willl there be additional financial penalties? We simply want to shock his former wife to stop "double-dipping " and get justice.
Welcome your thoughts and experience.
So here is my plan in short we start a new church(Church of BS as I am not reliegous) but will use the rules
Where by you donate all you income to it .... then we have a so call Mass(prey metting) and say "Dave" donated $500 we pray for Dave to have his rent/food/car paid for.... the church then makes a mercy payment to all Dave's need... Now this system would pay no tax as the churches are tax exempt ... Dave would personally claim a small income say $18000 a year to and show he is working this will keep the CSA wolves at bay... ie Dave pays a minimum amount per year to the CSA( or a lot less then he would without his generosity to the Church of BS.
1. More then likely you would have to work for the Church of BS
IE the Church invoices your normal paycheck to the employer... the church then employs you and work cover and so on...
You would need renegotiate with your current employer this way the church dictates your income to CSA mongrels.
I think most bosses would think it be ok if not you move on to another job.
2. Probably need an ordain priest to run it to legitimizes the church. Remember we are not trying to break laws but use the current laws against the BS system.
3. Critical mass... we need x amount of members to make it all work....
No Gov is going to say it is not real ... ie we must believe in making the payment and receiving help from the lord...(remember I am not religious) but if I received help with all my bills paid ... I might believe.
The beauty about this system is that not a thing the Gov could do about it unless the churches/charities where attacked... And no Gov would dare do that...
Im in the same boat as most of you dealing with CSA and the courts, im a fairly level headed bloke when it comes to this crap we deal with, if you are thinking on how to change things then you need to get behind your computers and start typing, i mean emails to politicians, emails to the DSS (Department of social services) they are the governing body on the legislation which creates this system. If all of us type our realistic problems without abuse :) then things will change. Dont be afraid to write to Pollies, i wrote an email to a conservative pollie and had a reply email in less than an hour with another reply to come and speak with him 3 days later. Just keep cool headed and think straight and keep it to realistic problems and it will work.
Im no expert im just a normal tradie!
You must learn to help yourselves.
If you are dealing with CSA then you must learn to play the game. Understand the rules of the game and the end goals. An analogy is like playing the game of AFL football. CSA is a professional team that knows the rules and can even bend or change the rules when it suits them. They practise all the time and have huge resources to get what they want. We are the other team that have wandered onto the oval, unorganised and as individuals are not a cohesive team. We have limited resources and do not know the rules of the game but must play anyway. You my think you know what is going on but in fact you do not. Even blind Freddie can see the outcome of this game. If you do not understand the players and the game then you will never understand why you are in the position that you are. Your aim should be to take back some control of the game and your life.
Know your opponents and what they actually want. CSA is a faceless bureaucratic machine that has no interest what so ever in you, your ex or your children's welfare. They do not care if you are broke or hungry or living in your car. They only have one goal and that is to reduce the amount of money that the government has to pay out in social services payments. The more you pay the less they pay.
The rules of the game are very convoluted and I doubt anyone knows them all. Your aim should be to get an understanding of the rules that apply to your situation. They are all on the internet but you must dig to find them then try to understand them. Reading forums can help but also cause confusion. Many have their own ideas on what should happen but are in actual fact wrong. CSA are quite happy the rules are complicated because then when you give up out of frustration they have won the game. Taking back some control of this game takes a large amount of effort and time at first. It may involve great changes in your life but as with everything else you do you only get out what you are prepared to put into it. It is your life and only you can do something about it. Screaming at and abusing CSA is like pissing into the wind. The only person covered in piss is you. Concern yourself with the things that you can change and do not get hung up on the things that you cannot change. It is not an overnight fix and I suspect most will not even bother. For those that do though there is the reward of a more stable life that you now have some control over.
Remember you are the foundation of your life. You are the most important one. Do what you need to do to survive and be strong. Everything else comes after this.
can any father who works in a business and is being overcharged by the government for child support
Can I get deductions because I am buying goods and items including truck to carry on with my business
Child support payments it overwhelming me and I am having trouble carrying on earning a living can anyone help me with
I AM FEELING OVERWHELMED
Just a thought provoking comment i would like to make.
If a small homosexual lobby representing a tiny minority of homosexuals can force the gov tards to force us to accept their bogus marriage plebiscite and votes etc etc, to add wasting tax payers money on it.
Then why cant the huge amount of people,father's groups ,church groups? , suicide statistics ,letters,various surveys and constant outcry by the fathers of this nation ....make any difference to this barbaric family flaw/child support crime syndicate?
the system allows the wife to take your kids and your money and reward them for it.
The system is so screwed and they wonder why Fathers lose the plot kill them selves or others, i know if it wearn't for my now new wife i wouldn't be on this planet.
if you are going to lawyers and she is taking you for everything you are best to just give it to her you will fight and fight and pay your lawyer tens of thousands of dollars only to lose it all anyway don't get a lawyer they are all just in it for money.
i am over my situation and its been over 3 years.
id like to say it gets better and eventually you'll move on but that aint the truth you will never recover from this and you will miss out on your kids growing up and be financially ruled by CSA, unless you are one of the lucky few that have an ex that is reasonable and you can keep CSA out and work it out between you.
Yes you should pay to help raise your kids but it should be dictated to you how to do that.
In Accordance with Federal Rule 5(b)(2) which states the following in regard to service of documents:
(2) Service in General. A paper is served under this rule by:
(A) handing it to the person;
(B) leaving it:
(i) at the person's office with a clerk or other person in charge or, if no one is in charge, in a conspicuous place in the office; or
(ii) if the person has no office or the office is closed, at the person's dwelling or usual place of abode with someone of suitable age and discretion who resides there;
(C) mailing it to the person's last known address—in which event service is complete upon mailing;
(D) leaving it with the court clerk if the person has no known address;
(E) sending it by electronic means if the person consented in writing—in which event service is complete upon transmission, but is not effective if the serving party learns that it did not reach the person to be served; or
(F) delivering it by any other means that the person consented to in writing—in which event service is complete when the person making service delivers it to the agency designated to make delivery.
The undersigned being duly sworn, deposes and says:
_________________________________________ is not the party to the action, is over 18 years of age and resides at__________________________________[please write complete address]
That on________________________________[date of service], deponent served the within_________________________________[name of documents served] upon ______________________________[Complete address where other party/corporation served]
METHOD OF SERVICE
____ [Check or ‘X’] Service by Mail: by depositing a true copy of the aforesaid documents in a postpaid properly addressed envelope in a post office or official depository under the exclusive care and custody of the United Postal Service.
Sworn to before me this ______________________
Day of _____________________
I have been completely alienated from my child after a custody battle that left me with absolutely no faith in the broken system. When one parent continuously puts there child in dangerous and unhealthy situations and fails to meet even the basic care requirements for their child and alienates the other parent completely. CSA and the courts don't care so long as the maternal mother retains custody.
We men are victims only due to the fact we do not give birth to the child. The fact that child support has a blanket approach to child support and more recently more power to violate our right to support our children is outrageous.
I hope by writing here I can at least add a small amount of help to make things fairer and stop PAS and using kids as pawns for ill gotten gain
LOL, shoe on the other foot. She immediately said she has a number of AVO' s against certain individuals which I took as a threat.
Contact number is (07) 3551 5771.
In may 2016 I had an operation, the results were not good, July I had a second operation still mending but looking promising. The company I worked for restructured in late June 2016 and I took advantage of Redundancy as I was not going to be able to return to work or the same type of work. My Wife has a well paid job so we were able to manage financially. Tight but we get by. I paid maintenance as long as my redundancy lasted.
However even though I have to date paid my maintenance to my ex wife on time every time the CSA want more.
As I don't work I have NO income, I have not signed on at Centre Link as me and my wife joint income makes us ineligible. Yet the CSA want maintenance, when I ask where from they suggest the Wife pays it. This goes down like a lead ballon.
I can either ignore the payment which to be fair are very unjust and go into debt or seperate from my wife become single sign on at Centre Link and screw the system.
We used to have my daughter ever other weekend and half the school holidays until she turned 13, the increase in maintenance caused issues and when looked in to my wife released that, yes we get a reduction in maintenance for every other weekend but half school holidays nothing. My wife sees this as double dipping by my ex wife. We look after her half the school holidays and pay the ex wife for the pleasure on top of the costs at home. Once realised this stopped my wife will no longer have Rose on school holiday. I feel stuck in the middle as is my daughter The CSA are to blame for this. I can see my wife position its hard to argue with, if I do it causes problems.
The CSA are not looking after he child's best interests, they are minimising the payments centre link have to make in my opinion.
Im considering taking legal again against centre link but fighting the system even for a just cause looks very daunting.
Sorry for the rant.
I'm one of them dad that I say yes for all what
The want to take from me.
Today I received latter from her lower asking
To show all my asset pool so the can take it from me
I don't know what to do
The system is bullshit
My ex and i have 2 boys 13 and 10. We seperated when my youngest was 6 months old. I get my boys every fortnight on a weekend. Id never get them during the week due to "it" knowing the system too well. I dont want to go down the whole court thing because of the parental alienation she uses. Im an honest man who works hard and pays what i am told by cs to pay every week without fail. My gripe is this. Every year my cs goes up. Im not on a lot of money but need to work extra overtime to compensate for the extra i have to pay. Next year comes along and bam, up goes my cs and so on and so on. Im really starting to struggle. Im remarried with a 3yr old daughter and am seeing my wife and daughter less and less. I earnt an extra $3k this year and have to pay an extra $1.2k and when you think of the tax i pay on the extra $3k i earnt it doesnt leave much of the extra hours i had to work to pay cs and tax. The kick in the guts is "it" earnt an extra $11k this year and when the did a provisional assessment on her wage was the $11k less i had to pay 623 a month then did one on her actual ( 11k more ) was 620 amonth. I got a reduction of a massive $0.81 a week on the $11 fucking grand extra she earnt from last year. Ill continue to pay what i have to everu year, working longer not seeing my family to make ends meat whe this stupind system gives ut to her and the government take the rest in tax. God i love my life....
Sign the petition and lets get things real with CSA!
You will also learn valuable information on how to deal with different issues!!
Hello to all
I have been unemployed for the last 2 years and have paid monthly support payments through CSA out of my termination payment and savings every month. I did not inform CSA that I was still unemployed after july 2016 (apparently every 12 months I am meant to do that) so decided to bill me based on my termination pay from 2015, which put me in debt by about 12k. I just completed my 2015/16 tax which was my termination payout, and they have billed me another 12k from my termination package. So they have essentially double dipped. For the only income I received in 2015/16 was a one of termination payment. So I have been incorrectly assessed as I have not been working, I did tell then in 2015 I was Terminated and would be receiving a Termination payment. Just asking is the legit and is there anything I can do. They say too bad too sad.
Hi Doc, I took CSA through the SSAT system in 2013 and won. They were demanding and taking more than required (way less than your deal ) but still these pricks needed to be put in their place and stopped from doing what they did to you and me.
Well worth the exercise mate.
@Gary, request a copy of any agreement/contract that gives the CSA, ATO, any agency or any body/person any lawful right to any value from your labour without your consent. Don't argue or refuse, just ask Qs and have them produce proofs. Do discovery of all documents. You are the KING and they are but servants, albeit they would have you think otherwise. "
Hi Brian, where do i start to get such documents?? Cheers
CSA's latest stunt to me was to intercept nearly half my tax return knowing full well that she hasn't lodged her return therefore they use her last estimate of $20,000 (when in fact she earns over $40,000 and when the file is updated, they'll realise that I've overpaid.... and they'll just KEEP the money in credit.
I have written them (CSAholes) a nice letter of complaint so will be interesting to see what they say!
I divorced that x crement 7 years ago. She took me for everything, bankrupted me, and still plays every game you can imagine to make everything as difficult as possible. I got screwed over in court with the crappiest court orders you've ever seen, prob like most of us here.
What I would like to see happen is a major overhaul of the CSA system in Australia and give us real dads the rights to our children and the rights of fairness to change the CSA man-hating - womens-rigged bias to the whole system !!!
Anyone know how this could be done???
If only there was a real form of" good opposition " out there somewhere...
Many hurt people come here ,me included. Hurt by ex but more importantly the system.
Fight the system not each other.
The system helps no one it only allows funding people to hate each other through inequality, in a time of equality?.
Its all about awareness, child support is a fake bonus given to someone who hates or is at a misguided/heighten emotional state of mind(inflamed by family law solicitors psychological manipulators ), given as a right. When both parents had equal responsibility before.
This so called child support helps no one ,it creates more animosity, at an already difficult time. Fathers begging for access to their children are met with one sided laws, which lead them to a state of rage ,eg domestic violence.
On the other hand you have the ugly side which no democracy abiding media outlet will touch -SUICIDE.
28 men commit suicide each week as a result of helplessness, caused by inhuman family flaw outcomes/laws.
You may think you have won , but what? At what cost? Someone's life or a few dollars and misery , without any care for the father of the kids you call your own.
What a mess , stay strong people, fight the system not each other.
Revolution dreaming. ..